Talk:Zachris Topelius

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Untitled

It is a big joke to claim that Zacharias Topelius was Finland-Swedish. He was a prominent Fennoman 213.243.157.114 02:08, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I think your opinion is somewhat unique. :-) /Tuomas 00:08, 8 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I believe quite a lot of proiminent Fennomans were swedish-speakers, and hence Finland-Swedes since the term really means "Swedish-speaking Finlanders". // Habj 19:51, 13 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

As there were no or limited education in Finnish...meaning them all were Swedish speaking. No real option here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.4.234 (talk) 17:12, 18 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I think this article should also have some information about the Christmas carrols to which Topelius wrote the lyrics, namely "Sylvian Joululaulu" and "Varpusen Jouluaamu". --81.197.213.215 14:54, 25 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Statsråd

I wonder what statsråd means in context. In Sweden of today, it pretty much equals a minister in the government - but this is 19th century Finland, and I suppose it means something else - maybe some honorary title? (mentioning of him being appointed statsråd in Nordisk familjebok [1]). // Habj 19:51, 13 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"Verkligt statsråd" is the usual Swedish form of a Russian honorary title. I don't know if it had any basis in any actual position. u◦p◦p◦l◦a◦n◦d 20:36, 13 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Great! The problem is then what it should be called in English... I'll try to add a few words and see if that makes things more clear. // Habj 00:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

According to SAOB (here), the Russian form is dejstvitel' nyj statskij sovetnik. I would assume an established English translation already exists from back when these titles were real and important. Ask one of the Russians (like Mikkalai or Ghirlandajo) if they know this. u◦p◦p◦l◦a◦n◦d 05:50, 14 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Lemma

One link should be proof that 'Zachris' is the real name. To show the opposite: Finnish National library has 556 book-hits under the name 'Zacharias', only 10 under 'Zachris' (meaning that most books have Zacharias printed on it). The German Library in Helsinki has 98 books, only 1 under 'Zachris'. Google has , only 4,330 hits for 'Zachris', compared to 36.500 hits for 'Zacharias'. Biographies at kirjasto, official website of city Helsinki and many others name him 'Zacharias', many don't even mention the alternative version 'Zachris' while mentioning a few others like 'Sakari'. And if you go shopping at e.g. Amazon, you get for 'Zacharias' 159 book hits and a few in other categories. 'Zachris' brings only 71 books and nothing in other categories.

It is obvious that 'Zacharias' is much more used, widespread, and therefor I request that the article will be moved back. -- Cecil (talk) 17:09, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The link provided at the beginning of the article to the Zachris Topelius article in the National Biography of Finland is indeed enough.

In addition, as explained on the Finnish talk page, the Finnish National Library agrees that the recommended and standard form should be Zachris, and they will soon change their catalog accordingly. This recommendation is based on the current state of research as shown in recent publications. The fact that most books published until now used the baptismal name instead of the form Topelius himself used proves nothing except that until recently it was considered OK to ignore the wishes of a "famous" person concerning one of the most private and personal matters, their name, in favor of "official" names. --Espoo (talk) 20:47, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

So, one library will maybe (please provide like to the official announcement) change the name in only their catalog despite different print on the books themselves (or are the planing to also overpaint it on the books?). The WP naming conventions still request to use the common name, and that is clearly 'Zacharias'. Maybe in a few years they have success with their plan (which I doubt since the books all have a different name on the cover), but now the common name is still Zacharias and not Zachris, especially in the non-finish-speaking world. -- Cecil (talk) 23:32, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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