Talk:Witch-hazel

Hyphen

Witch-hazel or Witch Hazel ? Andy Mabbett 11:21, 20 Aug 2004 (UTC)

The latter is often seen, but the former is preferable, as it reduces the risk of confusion with hazels - MPF 12:38, 20 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Not so, but a recurring misconception, at least on Wikipedia and in some U.S. government agency publications. From a linguistic standpoint, inserting the hyphen would only act to underscore that it is a type of hazel. But, tragically, on the English Wikipedia we go more by consensus than by the rules of English. Dictionariescall it witch hazel, but what do they know? Eric ^talk 04:04, 16 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Um – the “consensus” seems to be on the other side.

All dictionaries that I have checked, the OED, the AHD, the Webster’s New World (the 3 best ones in my estimation), and even the one that most readers of this note are looking for, the Merriam-Webster, agree that “witch hazel” is 2 words, unhyphenated. If it is found hyphenated in “government publications” (about as reliable an authority on linguistics as they are on fiscal policy), it is probably where used attributively (i.e., as an adjective): two-word nouns are correctly hyphenated then (e.g., the witch-hazel family, a witch-hazel fork, a two-word noun).

So the hyphenated form is strictly Wikipedia’s invention. And justifying it with an “Ah thinks it’s preferable” type of argument laughs in the face of Wikipedia’s long-standing non-O.R. policy: just report it, don’t invent it. –Randall 71.62.27.246 (talk) 03:28, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki invented it? We must be really good since so many scholarly works use it:

"Witch-hazel" in William Cullina's Native Trees, Shrubs & Vines, p.133
"Witch-hazel" in Radford, Ahles, & Bell's Manual of the Vascular Flora of the Carolinas, p. 529. (ninth printing)
Michael Dirr uses "Witch-hazel" in The Reference Manual of Woody Plant Propagation but in some of his other works he uses "witchhazel".
Charles Fergus uses "Witch-hazel" in Trees of Pennsylvania and the Northeast, p. 156.
In Brockman & Merrilees' Trees of North America: a field guide to the major native and introduced species north of Mexico, p. 158, it is "witch-hazel".
Asa Gray uses "Witch-hazel" in Field, Forest, and Garden Botany, p. 140.
In An illustrated guide to eastern woodland wildflowers and trees, p. 54, it is "witch-hazel".
In Peterson's A Field Guide to Trees and Shrubs: Northeastern and North-Central United States and Southeastern and South-Central Canada, p. 264, it is "witch-hazel".
In Duncan & Duncan's Trees of the Southeastern United States, p. 240, is "witch-hazel".

There are a plethora of sources using witch-hazel.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 05:18, 23 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Middle English?

The sentence: "The name Witch has its origins in Middle English wiche, from the Old English wice, meaning "pliant" or "bendable"." seems questionable to me, since this is not a European plant, and the American colonists did not speak middle English. Were the Chinese or Japanese species grown in England before the 15th century? --SB_Johnny|^talk|_books 12:06, 19 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The OED agrees with this etymology of the word "witch" as meaning pliant. Where the "witch hazel" grew and when is not relevant to the etymology of "witch".--Shantavira 08:06, 3 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The earliest British settlers spoke varieties of early Modern, not Middle English. In order to commonly invent a new plant name meaning "pliant" they would probably have to use the Middle English sense of the word in everyday life. In order to make the assertion in question, the contributor needs to demonstrate some other instance where any British-American settlers, whatsoever, used "witch" to indicate pliability. If you can do that, I might be convinced. It seems to me "witch" would be used to express a sort of otherness, or magical or medicinal purpose. Perhaps it was somehow the latter. And perhaps, the Native Americans helped settlers with the sense of the plant's name. For example, it appears numerous American locations were named for devils or witches because of their religious or magical significance in Native cultures. Do you suppose there is anything about the plant that might inspire that kind of thing? --Rigel711 (talk) 22:13, 12 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Writing wikipedia is rather easier than that, as we just need to figure out what the sources say, not research the topic. As long as the dictionaries say "pliant" we should go with that, unless perhaps if there are good sources to the contrary. I don't have an OED handy, but I did add a citation to the Online Etymological Dictionary. Kingdon (talk) 19:50, 14 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I can't find any definition anywhere of "instrumentitis" -- what the heck is that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.25.198.139 (talk) 08:00, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Howdy- not really sure of whether to add something, not being a normal wiki contributor. Witch hazel prevents biofilms from forming by disrupting(off the top of my head- don't remember the full pathway) communication between bacterial colonies; a rather unique effect among plants. Some potential sources are (Discover Magazine, July/Aug 2009), and http://molpharm.aspetjournals.org/content/early/2008/02/26/mol.107.044164.full.pdf. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.180.234.101 (talk) 19:39, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Despite the denial in the English article that 'witch' has anything to with magic or sorcery, I'm struck by the fact that the German and Dutch names for the plant are 'Zaubernuss' (= magic nut) and 'toverhazelaar' (= magic hazel) respectively. So just how reliable is the source on 'pliancy'?84.243.236.9 (talk) 15:50, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Food uses should refer to culinary uses.

This section should refer to the use of the plant as an ingredient in human food.

The use given in this article as an insect food, should be titled something like:

Ecology, role in food chain.

or

Interactions with other (non human) spices.

if biologists agree.

Moreover, this pages may be a source for data mining, information retrieval, etc. if more precise titles are used in a consistent way. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Elias (talk • contribs) 17:24, 20 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, especially since that section was under "Cultivation and uses". I've made the edit. As for "official" section headings, I more or less try to follow Wikipedia:WikiProject Plants/Template, although it isn't intended to rigidly apply to all articles. Kingdon (talk) 03:26, 21 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with article on hamamelis?

As far as I can see, witch hazel (witch-hazel) and hamamelis are exactly the same plant. However, they have become separated in Wikipedia, with different language versions. Thus there's no Dutch version under 'witch hazel', but there is one under 'hamamelis', and there are German, English, Norwegian and Upper Sorbian versions under both, but they don't match. Finally, there are only 5 language versions under 'hamamelis', and 27 under 'witch hazel'. The two sets of articles have evidently been written by people who were unaware of the other one - a common failing in Wikipedia! Not being a botanist, I have no idea which information is more accurate. I wanted to check if the Dutch plant 'toverhazelaar' and the English 'witch hazel' were the same, and was surprised to find there was no Dutch version of the 'witch hazel' article - then I looked for the Dutch term and discovered it in the 'hamamelis' article.

I've put a similar comment on the talk page for 'hamamelis'.84.243.236.9 (talk) 15:50, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

They are not the same. Witch-hazel refers to the genus Hamamelis containing all Hamamelis species. Hamamelis × intermedia is just one species within the genus. Darorcilmir (talk) 18:32, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Applications

I may have overlooked something, but I can't see any reference to pain relief - and I have personal experience of witch hazel being used for this. When I was 10 years old, someone accidentally slammed a car door on the tips of my fingers - the nails on the two longest fingers turned black and eventually fell off, and the pain was awful and went on for weeks (though luckily nothing was broken). My mother had once been a registered nurse in Britain (so I'm not talking about someone who relied on 'natural' remedies - she was a firm believer in Western medicine, and took me to be vaccinated against polio when the Salk vaccine first became available in the 1950s). She went to the pharmacy, bought what she called 'witch hazel' (perhaps the 'witch hazel water' referred to in the article), and applied it to my painful finger tips. The effect was never long-lasting, so she kept on applying it, and let me tell you it helped! It also smelled nice, which helped too.84.243.236.9 (talk) 16:08, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The answer seems adequately provided in the section and sources on Safety. Witch hazel solutions were systematically evaluated in a condition of more serious pain - perineal tears following childbirth, PMID 22592710 - finding no better effect than using ice (which was probably too inconvenient for a nurse to recommend for sore fingers ;>). --Zefr (talk) 16:25, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note that the current section "History of Medical Use" refers to the work of 3 people: Dr. Charles Hawes, Alvan Whittemore,and Thomas Newton Dickinson Sr. As one can see from the article Pond's, Theron T. Pond was doing the same things at about the same time with witch hazel extract. The Pond's brand still exists, and needs to be referenced. I have made a link, but perhaps there is more history behind this. Were the three persons collaborators with Pond or competitors? Wastrel Way (talk) 00:29, 10 August 2024 (UTC)Eric[reply]

I saw that you used the Pond's company website as a source, but there is promotion on that site, WP:PROMO. Let's try to find a better neutral reliable source. Otherwise, I made these changes to the History subsection. Zefr (talk) 03:07, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Witch hazel U.S.P.

I was looking for information about the witch hazel you can buy at a pharmacy. I landed on the plant page. Went disambig; went with the one about the astringent, and landed back here.

>  (Redirected from Witch hazel (astringent))

>   This article is about the plant genus. For other uses, see Witch hazel (disambiguation).

If you're going to combine the articles could you add a Witch hazel U.S.P. section?

173.120.182.205 (talk) 15:40, 1 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

EU versus Europe

and is commonly used for folk remedies in the European Union.

Only in the European Union, no European countries not in the EU use it for folk remedies? Probably should have "European Union" replaced with "Europe".

83.20.190.190 (talk) 18:22, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yup. Feel free to do such utterly obvious things without asking. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 19:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I took it further and removed the "common in Europe" part, since the sources didn't indicate any such thing. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 21:14, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]